TGP Concept is absolutely SHIT!

[Kappy]

Who the fuck had the idea to build galleries with 15 (!) pics and give them away for free? Or the idea to make a list for the surfers so that its more easy to find the free pics? Or to show on their TGP that there are 190,000 Galleries in their database, that are around 2,850,000 Pics, more than most paysites can offer. What the fuck is wrong here? Won't we make money?
It's clear, nobody is selling porn as dumb as we do in the online business. This is making me sick.
Isn't it time to make a change?

[fredicus]

TGP2 Was an attempt to change ... too little too late :(
Is, perchance:
null**Isn't it time to make a change?**
A rhetorical question ?

[Trax]

hehe took you very long to notice that :)

[Due]

15 pix?
I convert better with 17 pix than with 12 pix. I never converted with daily pictures (1 picture) so the more pix you give the surfers the more signups you will get ;)
Offcourse people with mass produced galleries on 1-2 templates will have little or no signups.

[*Kimmykim*]

Come now Kappy, surely if you stand and give out gallons of milk every day to those that are thirsty, they will want to buy your cow.

[Kappy]

@ fredicus
I think TGP2 was a great idea, but it was also clear that it wouldn't work. 5 Pics per Gallery was a too hard difference to the actual amount of content per gallery.
But why we don't change to lesser nudity and showing of pink. Like someone mentioned before: Let your surfers pay for pink! One of my submissions few months ago was denied because of not enough nudity. I mean what the hell...

@ Due
I think you had a higher position on the listings (or a better design of course). Nobody of the freeloaders will count your pics and signup on the result :)

[Kappy]

Originally posted by *Kimmykim*:
<STRONG>Come now Kappy, surely if you stand and give out gallons of milk every day to those that are thirsty, they will want to buy your cow.</STRONG>

Yeah sure, but our concept is to give them more milk every day till they are full and we have to pay the oats-bill

[drumsicle]

Originally posted by *Kimmykim*:
<STRONG>Come now Kappy, surely if you stand and give out gallons of milk every day to those that are thirsty, they will want to buy your cow.</STRONG>

I think you have to give them a small taste not a few gallons. But nowadays, it doesn't matter because the next farmer will give them the whole damn cow.

Truth is I made almost no money when my site was a tgp. But I didn't have the patience to wait for tens of thousands of bookmarkers either. Now there is no free porn on my site except a few large thumbs, and I make money. It's from a dialer, but it's money.

[Kappy]

Drumsicle, thats very interresting. Do u use skimming to keep the trades???

[Plat]

You would be suprised. I know a few TGP2 sites that get well over 800k uniques.

5 Pics in each gallery.. and they create all their galleries themselves. So heh major $ im sure.

[drumsicle]

Originally posted by Kappy:
<STRONG>Drumsicle, thats very interresting. Do u use skimming to keep the trades???</STRONG>

No, I used to. Now, everything you click whether it's a thumb or text link goes right to a trade. It's a total CJ I guess.

[Kappy]

Drumsicle, but where is the link to the dialer???

[Kappy]

Originally posted by Plat:
<STRONG>You would be suprised. I know a few TGP2 sites that get well over 800k uniques.
</STRONG>

Puh, what a month could bring.
Look at http://www.tgp2counter.com/

[drumsicle]

Originally posted by Kappy:
<STRONG>Drumsicle, but where is the link to the dialer???</STRONG>

There are some of those "download movie" images, but I don't think 99% get that far down the page. But, I'm using active x when they enter. Others are using java alerts.

[Mogul]

Who ever said you were supossed to TGP to make money?

TGPing is good for branding and toplist traffic generation.

"It's clear, nobody is selling porn as dumb as we do in the online business"

I agree. You guys are fucking morons. I hear 7-11 is hiring non arabs now. People might want to scoot down there before it is too late.

Simple concepts from simple minds.

Mogul

[Kappy]

Originally posted by drumsicle:
[QB]

There are some of those "download movie" images, but I don't...QB]

Didn't you get problems with your trades? Most of mine disallow activ x.

[Plat]

The funny thing is.. some very big sites are out there. Just that nobody knows of them right away because they dont keep their stats on sextracker or sexlist.. or any of those tracking companies.

If you want your layout snatched then plz sign up for a free counter.

[Kappy]

@Plat
I'm very surprised if there are so big TGP2 sites out, but we'll need more of them...

[maxuscz]

TGP is BAD IDEA...
but TheHan have 1 500 000 users every day, WorldSex 1 000 000 and etc.
You can't change reality but you can use it for make more money. (IMHO)
2 year befor I need post 10 pics only, but now tgp owners have now new rules - 15 and more pics.
Who write this rules?
And who post 20 pics per gallery for good positions and good chanse to be added in the "Big Brothers Coalition" like TheHun, WorldSex, Elephantlist and other ?

[drumsicle]

Originally posted by Kappy:
<STRONG>

Didn't you get problems with your trades? Most of mine disallow activ x.</STRONG>

Yes it is hard to find good trades that will allow this, but they are out there.

[Plat]

Yes but thehun and worldsex make all their money off advertising.

Smaller sites need to make money off anything they can make money off of right? So they build galleries TGP2 style. Less pictures, higher conversions.. more sex for everyone :c)

BUT you have to know how shit works in order to be successful!

[Plat]

Also like I stated in a post sometime last year...

If Free porn was no more.. only thing available were paysites. We could join together.. monoplize this adult business and charge a super high price to get in.

If someone would put a ban on free sites that would rule...or then maybe it would start turning more and more like warez if that happened...

Just imagine.. We run paysites. Charge $50+ a month (IF EVERYONE WOULD CHARGE NO LESS THAN $50 A MONTH THAT WOULD BE THE MINIMUM.. MAYBE A FUCKING LAW WILL BE MADE BY GOD KNOWS WHO) No such thing as free sites = a whole lot of cash into our bank accounts.

So instead of fighting who can provide the best bannerless free porn site, lets fight with paysites?

Those are my 2cents, keep the change.

[gse]

cause it's very hard and expensive to run your paysites nowadays. Competition from big sites, then processing nightmare, cheap surfers. The only thing left to do for small webmaster is to build galleries in hopes of 1-2 signups to sponsor. Multipy it number of webmasters and we got all mighty freloading internet for the surfer. :o

[toker]

I said it before and i will say it again..

When you pay for my content and my expenses i will build everything to "your" standards. Untill then shut your yap and if you cant sell shit then like mentioned above get a job in 7-11 with asalamalickem.

This is a business just like any other business you have the right to run yours your way and other their way.

If one resturant gives free food to 50 people a night does that mean the guy next door has to do same?

Simple there are to many sites already having plenty of content who will never remove and many have stolen it anyway. So the best thing to do is weed out content and layout thieves and then you will finally do some good.

Sure most all newbees borrow a few images to start but i see galleries with like 40 images all assorted and i can tell no one would pay money for shit images. Then i notice that person has violated all my rules again a guy who pay for content will actually care about blacklists.

I personally would never list an assorted gallery that has images of differ sizes and quality beause i now more then likely they have "borrowed" them. So there are small things everyone can do and it will all add up to push out the cheaters and thieves.

You dont need to rewrite the rule of thumb just try to make what you already have better. ;)

[shane]

yea somepeople devote their lives to poluting the web with as much free shit as they can.
they are either:
1- Love perving at porn 24/7
2- To stuped to make a CJ site

:D

[Kappy]

@ toker
I don't think this will work over the next years. I think most ppl sign up for memberships in order to get more quality, sorted galleries, I mean better one than on TGPs. If you'll list only galleries with high quality content and many sorted pics the need to signup for memberships will get lesser and lesser, cause there they don't get anything else than on your site for free. You'll only get more uniques, but the signup-quality of the traffic will sinking down. We can see it all today, the quality and quantity of the TGPs is enough for most surfers, they're not willing to pay for this little difference to paysites.
And as TGP2 thing shows, it won't work if only a few ppl lower the content. Today online porn business is not like one restaurant giving free food to ppl, its like a city, a big glamour city where you can get as much as you like for free, you only have to enter. I know no business worldwide, which is giving this amount of their product for free to their customers.

[Kappy]

Originally posted by Plat:
<STRONG>If Free porn was no more.. only thing available were paysites.

So instead of fighting who can provide the best bannerless free porn site, lets fight with paysites?
</STRONG>

I think you're absolutely right. ;)

[Plat]

I'm always right :c)

[hal]

just imagine if all tgps would turn into tgp2s over night.........

[Pinhead]

It's still possible to make money from galleries and tgp's, as long as you don't argue that your surfers should sign up for a paysite just beacuase it has 100,000+ pictures...

[Dnalyxes]

The Guy who will have the next good idea will make good money but not with ideas like only 5 or 10 thumbs.I would never open a site where i will give tons of freestuff away.

international webmasters should change their systems cause they destroyed their own biz but there are too many ...... out.

Just my 3 ptas

[Kappy]

Originally posted by Pinhead:
<STRONG>It's still possible to make money from galleries and tgp's...</STRONG>

You are right, but is this the goal for which we're working, that its still possible?
People are normally willing to pay for porn, its like selling a drug, they want it, they need it. It normally have to be the most easiest thing to sell porn.

[Plat]

Adult webmasters are creating their own downfall. And the thing that hurts us most are the new guys that throw up the worst popup hell sites thinking they are going to make money.

[Trax]

Originally posted by Plat:
<STRONG>Adult webmasters are creating their own downfall. And the thing that hurts us most are the new guys that throw up the worst popup hell sites thinking they are going to make money.</STRONG>

well said

[ragnar]

TGP's where started by people that couldn't make money with a cj site ;)

[matuloo]

I dont know what are posts like this one good for.

We all know TGPs are hurting the adult biz, the same goes for Free hosts or any other kind of site providing too much free content.

But do you think someone will stop doing it?

As long as there is at least a small portion of money to be made this way, people will go on and do it.

Greed is the thing that destroys this industry : cause there are still people looking for the fast buck no matter how bad the attempt of their actions is gonna be.

Tell someone to stop building galleries, because it is hurting the adult industry, and he is gonna smile into your face cause it is still making a fucking dime for him and than he will come back later on crying that this biz is fucked.

YOU WILL NEVER CHANGE THE ATTITUDE OF PEOPLE, UNTIL THERE IS A SMALL AMOUNT OF MONEY TO BE DONE, PEOPLE WILL DO IT !

[polaris]

everyone uses someone else to make money,,i am sure the mexican sweat shop kids are crying for u right now

[manga]

The problem with a lot of guys these days, especially newbies, is they can't think for themselves. They just look at what everyone else is doing and do the same. Only a fucking moron would start another tgp now, yet I see guys doing it everyday. Stupidity.

Be creative and don't listen to other people and you'll do well in any business, including porn.

[Mogul]

"The problem with a lot of guys these days, especially newbies, is they can't think for themselves."

This is very true. Also most people TGP because they have no skills at all. I think it is funny seeing all these idiots who tgp who put up a banner or some lame text saying the sufer should go join because this site is:
"#1"
"hot action"
"has 100k pics"
"um, because I put this banner up"

Idiots copying idiots.

Go to thehun.net. Why would I the surfer EVER spend $1 for porn pictures? The hun has thousands of fresh daily pictures, all high quality, fast and easy to watch.

Hell, he even has movies and this is only ONE site!

Surfers buy becuase the site is unqiue and recur because the content is. Maybe I am wrong but I do not know of ONE site that is unique from any big people like ARS, Helmy, etc..

I am amazed when people tell me they got one sale from their TGP shit. Fact is, if you TGP and promote these guys, for every sale you get, you could get 3-4 more if you knew what you were doing.

I wish we could go back when the domains were $100. Free hosting did not exist. Real hosting costed real dollars. :)

But I don't care. I made my money in the beginning of it all. Porn is becoming well-fare for the unskiled monkey.

Mogul
:D

[jmbrown1881]

I think alot of you experinced webmasters are right, I am new at this myself...starting last June. But I have seen no change will come in the current market of online porn. TGP is too popular and always will be. NOTHING will change this, not tgp2 or any new idea of giving away fewer pics because TOO many people will keep doing TGP's.
TGP's will stay, live with it, the only way to change it is for EVERYONE to quit TGP and that will not happen. Its a circle. TGP was started because it was a new idea years ago. Someone must have thought..."hey i got a paysite and I could open a site that has free pics of my paysite and sponser the hell out of it on the free site!" AND BAM that dude made money....everyone copied and now its flooded.
Shit, everyone knows that free porn exist and where to get it. I love Cj'c and crappy TGP's AND even TGP2's....why? cause I know once they get fucked around and end up at my site, THEY will stay becasue I dont jerk them like some get rich bastards. They stay bookmark and become loyal to my site, helping me grow. Once I get big enough..then the ads come and I can make money off my OWN paysite that I will promote on MY OWN site.
Shit some of you lame ass's never get it.
Its not free servers, TGP's or even low domain prices, ITS the fact that design software is easier to use now (dreamweaver..frontpage), scripts are easier, and more people are getting tech skilled. I know this becasue I didnt shit about nothing until i got dreamweaver and learned to make a page in about 5 mins.
Learn to market, learn to be different, and learn your surfers..Then you can make a difference.
Its not any sites fault, but the people that make those sites. Say what you want, but TGP2's and CJ's make the good quality sites money. Think about it

[jmbrown1881]

oh yeah, earlier it was said...
If no free sites were allowed, and we all charged 50 for a membership, we would get more money
First off, LOOK at real LIFE! If there is only one club in the city and they charge 10 bucks to get in, yeah they make money...but someone else see this and says "i can do this and charge 5" he builds his club and makes bank...then someone else does it for free. HOW THE HELL DO YOU THINK TGP'S STARTED!!! THIS SAME REASON.!
if we all did this, sooner or later TGP's would come back.
get a real site that isnt a copy and be real about it

[shunga]

I don't think the TGP format, or the link list format, for that matter, is the problem. I do think, however, that too many people are chasing counters, and the easiest way to increase traffic is showing pink, even hardcore. A TGP or link list that only accepts hardcore needs to examine it's priorities, in my opinion.

[toker]

Maybe a good idea not to catagorize it also you know some paysites dont even have the amount of time put into them as some TGPs.

[Atahualpa]

- no categories (like the hun)

- individual gallery descriptions (like the hun)

- not archived too long, absence of "275,000 galleries archived" shit (like the hun)

- some friendly words about how all this couldn't be possible without sponsors (like the hun)

- not asking and enforcing a min. of. 10 "thumbs" even for movies just because the form script has 10 as the smallest number. (accept 6, at least - like the hun)

I realize that most here probably do pic galleries rather than movies but that 10 movies thingy is driving me insane. I mean, come on! Must be 10 movies but 15 pics is enough? Someone isn't very strong in maths here. And then they go and list numerous galleries with hotlinks to @home and aol all the way

:rolleyes:

[toker]

I allow 5 movies minimum but most of the 10 movie guys just use much more shit quality stuff and only about 180bk each.

[toker]

BTW i have one guy who sends 3 1.5mb vids daily and i think thats fair for the quality but it really depends. I would never expect 10 1mb movies that would be in no ones favor but with 3 it really gives the surfer a real evaluation of quality.

[Atahualpa]

I submit 6 mpegs with 260-290 kb each, decent quality 356x240 no sound, that should be really enough, that's almost 1.5 MB stuff already - opposed to 15x35kb= 0.5 MB with a picture gallery. With 10 it would be almost 3 MB :rolleyes:

Even if those that do not hotlink AND convert enough to pay up for the bandwidth seem to proof that it is indeed possible, I do not see how it would be justified for the tgp's to ask for 10 mpegs with no freaking need and to enforce a "business" model that is based on stealing bandwidth for the most part cuz it just ain't work otherwise. How dumb is that?

[toker]

Well if you had a large moviepost raking in cash and the right connections im sure dropping 4.5MB of free vids a day is not a problem.

Again its marketing if you dont make sales you dont spend money if you make plenty of sales you can afford more advertising then the next guy.

[Atahualpa]

Sure, it seems to work out for the ultra-babes guy, but what I was saying is many tgp's and most movieposts ask for big movies and put "small" movies into a "small movies" category or not list them at all, and if you look through the not-so-small movies listings at least 50% of them are hotlinking from home and aol, but yet the tgp's have no prob to list those galleries above mine "cuz they have more and better" and they turn two blind eyes on all the hotlinking there.

Needless to say those @home kids just rip DVD's instead of actually buying content. Most of that content that I see on those galleries isn't available for licence AT ALL.

Ah well, I make money anyway... and surely hope those other folks get busted by aol or @home some day and get to see $xxx,xxx.xx bandwidth bills then

[vince]

I thought about writing a big speech, but decided not to waste my time! Why? because come tommorow most people would have forgotten about this post, gone back to the same old grind and in a months time end up right back here discussing the same issues without resolution!

Too many cheifs not enough indians!

How

[manga]

Originally posted by vince:
<STRONG>I thought about writing a big speech, but decided not to waste my time! Why? because come tommorow most people would have forgotten about this post, gone back to the same old grind and in a months time end up right back here discussing the same issues without resolution!

Too many cheifs not enough indians!

How</STRONG>

AGREED!

[*Kimmykim*]

Originally posted by Mogul:
<STRONG>Who ever said you were supossed to TGP to make money?

TGPing is good for branding and toplist traffic generation.

</STRONG>


Boy there's a revelation. Go talk branding with all the failed dot commers up in the Bay area.

Free porn is bad. Period. Showing someone a few thumbs and making them click thru to a sponsor to see more is not fucking the surfer, it's selling a product. Building a tgp and boasting that you have 200k free pics in the list, well that's just fucking STUPID for everyone but the tgp owner who's probably selling his listings instead of pushing joins.