Some questions about trading trafic

[2dxtreme]

I've been in the trading game for a little while now and it's going quite nice.

After trading with some sites and reading a lot of terms on the sign up pages I wonder about a few things some of you trading veterans can shed some light on for me

On a lot of those pages I read a lot about sites only accepting large trades 1k+
Personally the 100 to 200 hits trades are more productive then those large ones, and also in that range you get a lot less cheaters.

So I'm left wondering why do webmasters try so hard to only get those large trades. From my point of view it's not so much trouble to manage a lot of 100 to 200 trades and with the lesser cheaters it could even be less time consuming.

Could anybody explain to me where I'm wrong in this?
I'm asuming I'm missing something because so many sites have this rule(varying from min. 500 hits to 5k!).

Thanks in advance folks

[2dxtreme]

You guys don't know either? :eek:

[StwoF]

Originally posted by 2dxtreme
On a lot of those pages I read a lot about sites only accepting large trades 1k+
Personally the 100 to 200 hits trades are more productive then those large ones, and also in that range you get a lot less cheaters.If it's working then how could you be wrong. Keep it up! I think you need to explain more on your logic. How exaclty is it more productive? I'll say you have'nt been talking personally with any big tgp owners wanting to trade large amount of traffic. Small tgp owners are more desperate to get traffic so in turn they give more than needed. I suggest you network with your traders and maybe the big traders will push more. ;)

[ddt]

I'll just give two notes which I have made during my work with cj sites.
1. The growth of traffic in N times doesn't mean that your ratio will grow in N times.
2. Three cj's with 5k/day give you a better ratio than one with 20k/day.

But if someone has 50k/day on cj and makes a rule that only >1k traders are welcome, it tells just that this guy: a. has a lot of traffic and/or is not a newbie in biz; b. doesn't like to work with newbies.
If a trader sets a rule that he needs only >10k traders that means just that he doesn't need any more traders :)

[2dxtreme]

Thanks for the input guys but that's not what I meant.

I don't have a problem getting large trades to work, it's just that based on my own experiences I have a hard time following their logic.

I'll try my best to explain it better:

I have some nice trades doing 200 to 300 hits a day with an overall productivity of 250% and some even more.

I also have some large ones 3 to 5k daily that barely come to 100% prod.(and some barely make 80%)

I am guesing those smaller trades get their traffic from sources like SE and linksites(maybe also AVS) and that traffic is more productive as large traders get more traffic from trades.

Again that's MY gues.

So in that regard I just fail to understand why so many of the larger trade sites refuse to accept 100 to 300 trades. It's not that I can't meet their requirements it's the fact that I do not understand the why's and how's of it that I would like clarification on.

Taking right of the sign up page from one of the large ones:

I don't have time to fucking babysit all those small trades so 1k minimum period! If you can't send that don't waste my time

Now not all pages were that rude but most have something up to that extend.

Now compared to my own sites where I trade with large and small sites I have to question that logic, because I do not have to "babysit" them my script does that for me :)

But fact remains that I'm still fairly new to the game and seeing so many large sites have this requirement I think I have to asume that I am missing something, and I was hoping that by posting here somebody would explain to me where my line of thinking is wrong.

On the other hand the only cheaters I have ever caught(some thanks to this board) where over 1k trades. Therefor I asume that you get hit by cheaters more when you trade large. Which again makes me wonder why the honest large traders have this requirement up.

From what I can tell the mid size trades are better and easier to handle.

So again I must be missing something and because I would like to grow as a webmaster and offcourse grow my sites I think it is important to understand the trading game 100% :)

Thanks for the input and thanks in advance to those who are going to give their input after this reply.

[EMPTYBRAIN]

the 100 to 200 hits trades are more productive

So maybe they don't are 'bout prod? :confused:

[2dxtreme]

Originally posted by EMPTYBRAIN
the 100 to 200 hits trades are more productive

So maybe they don't are 'bout prod? :confused:

Maybe I'm way off here but isn't productivity what trading is all about?

I mean without good prod. trades die off because you can't send back what you get.

At least that's how I always understood it?

[ddt]

>Maybe I'm way off here but isn't productivity what trading is all about?
Yes it is. But don't forget the reasons why you are trading - you need high ratio!

>trades die off because you can't send back what you get.
Of course. And you must send them not what you get, but maximum of what you can send. 200%-300%.

[2dxtreme]

Originally posted by ddt
>Maybe I'm way off here but isn't productivity what trading is all about?
Yes it is. But don't forget the reasons why you are trading - you need high ratio!

>trades die off because you can't send back what you get.
Of course. And you must send them not what you get, but maximum of what you can send. 200%-300%.

Yes but that's directly related to the good prd. of those trades.

I mean what goo dis a trade that sends 1k from which only 16 click through while a trade sending 200 hits generates 250 clicks.

Also there is a limit as to what a trade can send so sending as much traffic as possible doesn't describe it 100% acurate I think.

But to get back on the topic I'm doing quite allright I just don't understand the motivation of some traderules of the bigger sites.

And being mr precise who needs to know everything that bugs me

:D

[Patrick-HG]

Hey 2dxtreme,

When you figure out the trading game, let me know. After 9 months I still haven’t figured it out yet.

As you already know, some trades require a minimum number a day; and when you send them that minimum. After a day or two they return fewer then what you sent them and remove you from their database :(

Some don’t have a minimum so you send them what you got after a few days; they also remove you from their database, lol

Others have a minimum, you barely get to meet that minimum and they still continue sending you hits and become your best friends ;)

There are actually a lot of kindhearted honest webmasters who write back emails and chat on ICQ trying to work with you, so contact them, it won't hurt.

Anyway, as I said, after 9 months I still haven’t figured it out yet but do have a vague idea. When you figure out the big secret feel free to drop me a note ;)

[2dxtreme]

Hey Patrick!

While I haven't figured out all the ins and outs yet after 3 months I do have a clue as to what I am doing.

Mostly thanks to the posts Choker made on this board. The info as simple as it was made all the difference for me.

As for trades that can you after sending hits, I too was frustrated about that, untill I emailed one of those that deleted a trade with me.

The guy mailed me back(I don't use ICQ for trades, to much spam on there) and explained it and it made sense.

In my case my traffic which performs well on my sites(I trade among my own sites too) on some trade sites it sucks(on those using thumbnails to trade for example).

So while I sent a decent amount it was not working for him. Offcourse I bitchingly replied "why didn't you say so I didn't fill out my contact info for fun! ya know?" But he also had a common sense reply for that one.

When you have a tradeform online and a link to it on your main(trade) page every nitwit and his brother signs up for a trade and notifying them all would be a full time job :D

So while it's not very convenient from my point of view it is the logicall decision from his point of view.

Actualy that's why my webmaster link goes to my dialer program :D

I pick out my trades because I don't want that hassle I described above, so I really can't blame the webmasters that kill a trade without notice.

For the record the wise words of Choker that helped me so much were:

Don't force or fiddle with your trades all the time, let the script do the work. That helped me greatly as I now only force to new trades the existing ones sustain themselves. and my traffic has doubled since then (from 20 to 40k per site!)

Hope it is as much help to you as it was to me :)

[roly]

my guess is a lot of the small 100/day trades allow you to be near the top in their toplists although another factor could be that the small trades in desperation to grow, click your links giving the impression of higher prod when in fact they're lowering your prod with your other trades. Obviously this isn't the case with a lot of trades but it's got to happen.

[2dxtreme]

A good log analyser allows you to spot that easy.

Cheater protection comes down to having the right tools ;)

No from what I can tell they are feeding more traffic from sources like Porndirectory, Sex Central and Green Guy, etc....

And let me tell you that is VERY productive traffic!

And for some reason those linksites get a lot of UK traffic which makes my dialer stats look awsome! :D

[DirkG]

Well at least in my experience, if you send me only a tiny bit of traffic, you wont get any back from my script as its busy sending out to all the 1000+ trades. If you want to try go ahead and sign up at

http://www.totally4free.com/cgi-bin/ucj/webmaster.cgi

I wont delete your trade until its been dead for a while, then I will ICQ or email you.
I do hace a few trades around 100-200 that keep getting traffic, but they are really productive.
Please let me know if you signup for a trade so I can authorise it.