Swiss bank account [Archive] - Adult Webmaster Info BBS

NoTax

03-26-2002, 03:28 PM

Hello, I'm from europe, & as i hate taxes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> as most of you do, i'm looking for a good reliable swiss bank... I need online banking and a creditcard... If someone here has good experiences, please share them with us (& URL please).... <img border="0" alt="[Finger]" title="" src="graemlins/finger.gif" /> taxes <img border="0" alt="[Finger]" title="" src="graemlins/finger.gif" />

emgee

03-26-2002, 03:31 PM

just try searchengines,and you will find something. <a href="http://www.ubs.com" target="_blank">http://www.ubs.com</a> (more at google;-)

NoTax

03-26-2002, 03:36 PM

emgee, thanks for the reply... i did quite a lot of research, found a lot of banks (f.e. <a href="http://swiss-bank-accounts.com)" target="_blank">http://swiss-bank-accounts.com)</a> but i'm looking for someone who has good experiences with a swiss bank (UBS must be one of the biggest, but their website is very confusing).....

DamageX

03-26-2002, 04:11 PM

You don't necessarily need a Swiss bank account, you can even try Liechtenstein or Luxembourg. If you're living within the EU then the latter would be ideal, as it is part of EU and still has managed to maintain it's banking laws intact. They have a banking confidentiality law that forbids any bank to disclose any information whatsoever about their customers, unless these are proven to be criminals. But I doubt it anyone in your country would prove you a criminal, after all, what the goverment don't know won't hurt it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

Zern

03-26-2002, 04:35 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by DamageX: You don't necessarily need a Swiss bank account, you can even try Liechtenstein or Luxembourg. If you're living within the EU then the latter would be ideal, as it is part of EU and still has managed to maintain it's banking laws intact. it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> <hr /></blockquote>Hello DamageX! Could you reccomend a good Luxembourg bank with working online banking systems and so... Do they open accounts online/by post/fax or should i go there in person... Thanks <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

Jizar ll

03-26-2002, 05:41 PM

Very interestin topic, i would like to know more about his too :-)

shane94

03-26-2002, 10:05 PM

Stop trying to scam and just pay your taxes. Without taxes thier would be no roads/defence/police/fire dept ect ect. Haven't we already covered this topic <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="rolleyes.gif" />

DamageX

03-26-2002, 10:11 PM

I don't know of any bank that opens accounts online, but I'm sure that if you guys did some digging you could open some numbered accounts on the phone. On the other hand, if my memory serves me right, numbered accounts are mostly used for private banking, i.e. $100000+. Try here: <a href="http://new.bank.lu/" target="_blank">http://new.bank.lu/</a> I think that there are a few banks listed there that offer online services. Shane, if your goverment took upwards of 70% of what you made online you'd be looking for an offshore account too.

SexySites

03-26-2002, 10:32 PM

i would think that banks need to see you in person and to show your passport etc id before opening an account ..not sure if swiss bank accounts are as lax as they used to be <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> dont quote me on this <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> laters, Chris

Dracula

03-27-2002, 01:29 AM

Whatever offshore account you'll get, you need to pay little taxes in your country, otherwise all that will look suspicious. Make your offshore account but find a way to pay a normal, little tax in your country.

DamageX

03-27-2002, 01:35 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Dracula: Whatever offshore account you'll get, you need to pay little taxes in your country, otherwise all that will look suspicious. Make your offshore account but find a way to pay a normal, little tax in your country.<hr /></blockquote>Actually, that would work differently depending on the country you live in and whatever other way of providing for yourself you have. If you're holding a day job next to being an adult webmaster, then go for the offshore all the way, just make sure as little people as possible know you make a pile of cash on the side. Again, if the government don't know it won't hurt them. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> You'll need to find out what will make you most inconspicuous for where you live.

justsexxx

03-27-2002, 03:11 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by No Tax: Hello, I'm from europe, & as i hate taxes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> as most of you do, i'm looking for a good reliable swiss bank... I need online banking and a creditcard... If someone here has good experiences, please share them with us (& URL please).... <img border="0" alt="[Finger]" title="" src="graemlins/finger.gif" /> taxes <img border="0" alt="[Finger]" title="" src="graemlins/finger.gif" /> <hr /></blockquote>First you always need to ID yourself. But then you have a bankaccount in Luxembourg or so. And then? How you want to spend your money on that account? Andre

NoTax

03-27-2002, 04:40 AM

Andre, you might read this about swiss bank secrets : <a href="http://www.swconsult.ch/chbanks/faq.htm" target="_blank">http://www.swconsult.ch/chbanks/faq.htm</a> 2nd, spending money is easy... you can get a creditcard which you can use at almost every ATM worldwide... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="cool.gif" /> Shane94 : you might be right about paying my taxes, if i would live in the US... The government where i live sucks, so why should i pay tax ? I'm looking for recommendations, if you use such a bank (switzerland, luxembourg etc) let us know !

justsexxx

03-27-2002, 05:35 AM

Where do you live then? Andre

justsexxx

03-27-2002, 05:38 AM

Well then you have a CC. But when you get some cash from another bank or whatever, they register your name...right? Andre

turf

03-27-2002, 06:01 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by justsexxx: Well then you have a CC. But when you get some cash from another bank or whatever, they register your name...right? Andre<hr /></blockquote>not the atm... its just a machine dude.. it doesnt know where you are from or who you are... It will just think that you are a person from that country withdrawing some cash for spending... so nope... with atm machines and a atm card or even better a visa/mastercard nothing will get recorded and reported...

Dracula

03-27-2002, 06:12 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by DamageX: <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Dracula: Whatever offshore account you'll get, you need to pay little taxes in your country, otherwise all that will look suspicious. Make your offshore account but find a way to pay a normal, little tax in your country.<hr /></blockquote>Actually, that would work differently depending on the country you live in and whatever other way of providing for yourself you have. If you're holding a day job next to being an adult webmaster, then go for the offshore all the way, just make sure as little people as possible know you make a pile of cash on the side. Again, if the government don't know it won't hurt them. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> You'll need to find out what will make you most inconspicuous for where you live.<hr /></blockquote>Ma Marcele, da ce destept te-ai facut dintr-o data! Sa nu-mi vina sa cred! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> Uite ca scriu in romana, poate iti aduci aminte ca: 1. D'aci ai plecat moshule <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> 2. La vara tot aici o sa te intorci <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="tongue.gif" /> Una peste alta, imi plac reply-uirile tale. You're the God of offshore accounts!

basschick

03-27-2002, 09:28 AM

if you ever want to buy a house, a car, or any of those fun amenities, consider declaring your taxes. that offshore account is not a good idea if you want to own large things someday. after all, every country i've ever heard of allows ALL your content and hosting and script purchases to be deducted before taxes are levied. you may think your government is stupid, but if you make $40,000 a year at your day job, and suddenly buy a $65,000 car or a $200,000 house, they will notice.

kong

03-27-2002, 10:17 AM

basschick... depending on you set it up... your offshore setup can own your car, house, etc. For those in the US spending with your offshore card, you might find this interesting. IRS Seeks Tax Cheats Through Offshore Credit-Card Records By JOHN D. MCKINNON Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL WASHINGTON -- Card-carrying tax cheats, beware. Uncle Sam is about to start peeking into credit-card accounts in search of thousands of Americans taking part in a fun-in-the-sun tax-avoidance scam that is part of a $70 billion-a-year drain on federal revenue. After months of haggling, the Internal Revenue Service and the Justice Department are close to an agreement with American Express Co. to turn over records from customers who pay their bills through banks in the Bahamas, the Cayman Islands and other tax havens, people familiar with the matter said. A second company, MasterCard International Ltd., also is in negotiations, MasterCard spokeswoman Sharon Gamsin said. The IRS, which declined to comment on the matter, is trying to identify and possibly prosecute cheats who use a simple and apparently increasingly popular scheme. Here is how it typically works: A taxpayer hires a lawyer in an offshore tax haven to create a sham corporation to hide the taxpayer's identity. Then the corporation obtains a credit card from a local bank and opens an account there. The taxpayer puts a bunch of unreported income into the account, thereby both hiding that sum from the IRS and avoiding taxes on the interest. The card is then used for purchases, and the lawyer pays the card balance from the corporate account, or the bank simply deducts the money itself. In some cases, the cardholder never even gets a monthly bill, leaving no incriminating paper trail. Getting access to the individual customer records will let the IRS compare customers' transactions with their tax returns. Investigators suspect that taxpayers aren't disclosing their control of offshore accounts, as they are required to on their tax returns. Taxpayers who are making use of the credit-card scam also are likely underreporting their income, by leaving out the money they have shipped offshore -- or at least aren't reporting the interest their accounts are earning. Taxpayers involved in the scam face big trouble, including back taxes, stiff penalties and possibly criminal charges. Thousands of taxpayers -- possibly tens of thousands -- are believed to have taken advantage of offshore accounts and credit cards. The scheme has been widely marketed on the Internet and elsewhere by lawyers and banks with offshore branches, often with a pitch that U.S. residents can skip paying taxes and avoid detection. One IRS consultant, Washington lawyer Jack Blum, estimated in 2000 that illegal offshore tax shelters cost the government $70 billion a year. Much of that involves individual taxpayers, but it is unclear how much involves credit-card holders. The credit-card scam has been going on for years. The IRS was slow to catch on, but a series of investigations in the mid-1990s revealed how it worked. All the IRS lacked were the names of tax cheats -- information it couldn't get from offshore banks in Caribbean tax havens because they refuse to share financial data with the U.S. So the IRS turned to U.S. credit-card networks, which were no more eager to turn over records. The IRS went to federal court in Miami in 2000 to ask a judge to force American Express and MasterCard to turn over records related to cards issued by offshore banks or were paid for from funds drawn on them. "We know from our experience that we've had consistent abuses," an IRS official who asked to remain anonymous said at the time. "Our experience indicates there are a lot of U.S. persons doing business and utilizing banks in those countries. We expect a number -- whether 5,000, 50,000 or 100,000, we don't know. We expect it to go into the thousands." U.S. District Judge Adalberto Jordan granted the request in October 2000. Thus began a long negotiation between the government and the credit-card companies. The IRS wanted broad disclosure, while the credit-card companies sought a narrow scope. The government's initial request covered 1998 and 1999 and involved Antigua and Barbuda, the Bahamas and the Cayman Islands, but the IRS is likely to expand its scrutiny to additional years, other tax havens and other card companies. For the Bush administration, the credit-card-scam crackdown serves a purpose beyond increasing revenue without raising taxes. It could provide a much-needed boost to its tax-shelter record, which some tax experts have criticized recently as insufficiently aggressive. The administration has sought to counter that impression, demanding more information about other kinds of shelters that U.S. promoters market onshore and setting the stage for nasty legal battles with accounting firms that are trying to protect their clients' identities. The IRS publicly hinted at progress in the negotiations with American Express and MasterCard in January, during an international tax conference in Miami. "If people think it's going to fade into the woodwork for lack of attention by the bureaucrats, they're sadly mistaken," Robert Panoff, a Miami tax lawyer who moderated the discussion, said in a later interview. "The IRS is like an elephant: It walks real slow, but if you're in its way when it gets to you it'll squash you." Mr. Panoff, who defends taxpayers, says he is encouraging his clients to avoid more-serious problems by fessing up now with amended returns. "But the window for doing so is getting smaller and smaller," he said. Even if the crackdown doesn't reap multiple scofflaws, a broader purpose of the investigation still would be served by access to the records -- identifying the scope of the offshore problem. The records could give investigators unprecedented insights into this murky world. IRS officials say privately that they suspect the use of credit cards by tax cheats began to increase about five years ago, with the rise of Internet sites that hawk the deals. Those sites continue to pitch a wide range of deals, lately including cards linking holders with U.S. automated teller machine networks. For example, a palm-draped Web site called Cardster this week advertised "top security anonymous offshore 'no ID' ATM Cirrus debit card," as well as other services. Law-enforcement officials say offshore credit and debit cards are so secure that they are effectively safer than cash. The cards typically are imprinted with meaningless account names and in some cases just numbers. Account holders can use phony names, so even signed card receipts don't offer any direct connection to a taxpayer. Because of their security advantages, offshore cards increasingly are used not only to evade taxes but also to make illicit payments and fund criminal operations. That is further elevating concern over offshore accounts, both for the Bush administration and other officials. The administration has recently announced tax information-sharing agreements recently with several of the major tax havens, including the Bahamas and the Cayman Islands. Those are expected to enhance the ability of U.S. tax authorities to find out more about suspected tax dodgers in the future. But the agreements only become effective over a period of years and have other limitations. For now, "if they're getting deposits into an offshore account, they are getting away with it," said John W. Moscow, deputy chief of the investigations division for New York City's Manhattan District Attorney Robert Morgenthau, a longtime critic of tax havens and their bank-secrecy laws.

JOP

03-27-2002, 07:25 PM

If you want an offshore bank account for whatever reason, make sure to go with a large company you can trust. <a href="http://www.credit-suisse.ch/" target="_blank">http://www.credit-suisse.ch/</a> for example for swiss bank accounts.

nasko

03-27-2002, 10:10 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by JOP: If you want an offshore bank account for whatever reason, make sure to go with a large company you can trust. <a href="http://www.credit-suisse.ch/" target="_blank">http://www.credit-suisse.ch/</a> for example for swiss bank accounts.<hr /></blockquote>You can't open bank account in Credit Suisse just like that. You have to have the millions first <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="smile.gif" />

stramm

03-28-2002, 10:17 AM

no problem to get a bank account at <a href="http://www.credit-suisse.ch/" target="_blank">http://www.credit-suisse.ch/</a> You have to give them a phone call and they'll send you a contract (they even mark where you have to sign). And they have a nice online banking system. A problem can be (if you're using the account for tax reasons) that they send you mail for every transaction.

JOP

03-28-2002, 07:02 PM

Don´t get confused by their private banking section. The normal banking anyone can use.

Prodigy

04-09-2002, 12:45 AM

Samuel

04-11-2002, 12:09 PM

I have allready fro 2 years account with UBS. Great services, gold MC and VISA, online access, adn so one, BUT you must be non US <img border="0" alt="[Finger]" title="" src="graemlins/finger.gif" /> If you still need help, let me know. I'll give URL, who open this account for me 600$, and in 10 days it was done.

Renegade

04-11-2002, 03:45 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Samuel: I have allready fro 2 years account with UBS. Great services, gold MC and VISA, online access, adn so one, BUT you must be non US <img border="0" alt="[Finger]" title="" src="graemlins/finger.gif" /> If you still need help, let me know. I'll give URL, who open this account for me 600$, and in 10 days it was done.<hr /></blockquote>hey Samuel, let us know the URL please... thank you !

Samuel

04-12-2002, 01:08 PM

<a href="http://switzerland.isyours.com/e/index.html" target="_blank">http://switzerland.isyours.com/e/index.html</a> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Aquaman

04-12-2002, 01:16 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by kong: basschick... depending on you set it up... your offshore setup can own your car, house, etc. For those in the US spending with your offshore card, you might find this interesting. IRS Seeks Tax Cheats Through Offshore Credit-Card Records By JOHN D. MCKINNON Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL WASHINGTON -- Card-carrying tax cheats, beware. Uncle Sam is about to start peeking into credit-card accounts in search of thousands of Americans taking part in a fun-in-the-sun tax-avoidance scam that is part of a $70 billion-a-year drain on federal revenue. After months of haggling, the Internal Revenue Service and the Justice Department are close to an agreement with American Express Co. to turn over records from customers who pay their bills through banks in the Bahamas, the Cayman Islands and other tax havens, people familiar with the matter said. A second company, MasterCard International Ltd., also is in negotiations, MasterCard spokeswoman Sharon Gamsin said. The IRS, which declined to comment on the matter, is trying to identify and possibly prosecute cheats who use a simple and apparently increasingly popular scheme. Here is how it typically works: A taxpayer hires a lawyer in an offshore tax haven to create a sham corporation to hide the taxpayer's identity. Then the corporation obtains a credit card from a local bank and opens an account there. The taxpayer puts a bunch of unreported income into the account, thereby both hiding that sum from the IRS and avoiding taxes on the interest. The card is then used for purchases, and the lawyer pays the card balance from the corporate account, or the bank simply deducts the money itself. In some cases, the cardholder never even gets a monthly bill, leaving no incriminating paper trail. Getting access to the individual customer records will let the IRS compare customers' transactions with their tax returns. Investigators suspect that taxpayers aren't disclosing their control of offshore accounts, as they are required to on their tax returns. Taxpayers who are making use of the credit-card scam also are likely underreporting their income, by leaving out the money they have shipped offshore -- or at least aren't reporting the interest their accounts are earning. Taxpayers involved in the scam face big trouble, including back taxes, stiff penalties and possibly criminal charges. Thousands of taxpayers -- possibly tens of thousands -- are believed to have taken advantage of offshore accounts and credit cards. The scheme has been widely marketed on the Internet and elsewhere by lawyers and banks with offshore branches, often with a pitch that U.S. residents can skip paying taxes and avoid detection. One IRS consultant, Washington lawyer Jack Blum, estimated in 2000 that illegal offshore tax shelters cost the government $70 billion a year. Much of that involves individual taxpayers, but it is unclear how much involves credit-card holders. The credit-card scam has been going on for years. The IRS was slow to catch on, but a series of investigations in the mid-1990s revealed how it worked. All the IRS lacked were the names of tax cheats -- information it couldn't get from offshore banks in Caribbean tax havens because they refuse to share financial data with the U.S. So the IRS turned to U.S. credit-card networks, which were no more eager to turn over records. The IRS went to federal court in Miami in 2000 to ask a judge to force American Express and MasterCard to turn over records related to cards issued by offshore banks or were paid for from funds drawn on them. "We know from our experience that we've had consistent abuses," an IRS official who asked to remain anonymous said at the time. "Our experience indicates there are a lot of U.S. persons doing business and utilizing banks in those countries. We expect a number -- whether 5,000, 50,000 or 100,000, we don't know. We expect it to go into the thousands." U.S. District Judge Adalberto Jordan granted the request in October 2000. Thus began a long negotiation between the government and the credit-card companies. The IRS wanted broad disclosure, while the credit-card companies sought a narrow scope. The government's initial request covered 1998 and 1999 and involved Antigua and Barbuda, the Bahamas and the Cayman Islands, but the IRS is likely to expand its scrutiny to additional years, other tax havens and other card companies. For the Bush administration, the credit-card-scam crackdown serves a purpose beyond increasing revenue without raising taxes. It could provide a much-needed boost to its tax-shelter record, which some tax experts have criticized recently as insufficiently aggressive. The administration has sought to counter that impression, demanding more information about other kinds of shelters that U.S. promoters market onshore and setting the stage for nasty legal battles with accounting firms that are trying to protect their clients' identities. The IRS publicly hinted at progress in the negotiations with American Express and MasterCard in January, during an international tax conference in Miami. "If people think it's going to fade into the woodwork for lack of attention by the bureaucrats, they're sadly mistaken," Robert Panoff, a Miami tax lawyer who moderated the discussion, said in a later interview. "The IRS is like an elephant: It walks real slow, but if you're in its way when it gets to you it'll squash you." Mr. Panoff, who defends taxpayers, says he is encouraging his clients to avoid more-serious problems by fessing up now with amended returns. "But the window for doing so is getting smaller and smaller," he said. Even if the crackdown doesn't reap multiple scofflaws, a broader purpose of the investigation still would be served by access to the records -- identifying the scope of the offshore problem. The records could give investigators unprecedented insights into this murky world. IRS officials say privately that they suspect the use of credit cards by tax cheats began to increase about five years ago, with the rise of Internet sites that hawk the deals. Those sites continue to pitch a wide range of deals, lately including cards linking holders with U.S. automated teller machine networks. For example, a palm-draped Web site called Cardster this week advertised "top security anonymous offshore 'no ID' ATM Cirrus debit card," as well as other services. Law-enforcement officials say offshore credit and debit cards are so secure that they are effectively safer than cash. The cards typically are imprinted with meaningless account names and in some cases just numbers. Account holders can use phony names, so even signed card receipts don't offer any direct connection to a taxpayer. Because of their security advantages, offshore cards increasingly are used not only to evade taxes but also to make illicit payments and fund criminal operations. That is further elevating concern over offshore accounts, both for the Bush administration and other officials. The administration has recently announced tax information-sharing agreements recently with several of the major tax havens, including the Bahamas and the Cayman Islands. Those are expected to enhance the ability of U.S. tax authorities to find out more about suspected tax dodgers in the future. But the agreements only become effective over a period of years and have other limitations. For now, "if they're getting deposits into an offshore account, they are getting away with it," said John W. Moscow, deputy chief of the investigations division for New York City's Manhattan District Attorney Robert Morgenthau, a longtime critic of tax havens and their bank-secrecy laws.<hr /></blockquote>I just quoted this post to piss you off.

Aquaman

04-12-2002, 01:20 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Aquaman: <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by kong: basschick... depending on you set it up... your offshore setup can own your car, house, etc. For those in the US spending with your offshore card, you might find this interesting. IRS Seeks Tax Cheats Through Offshore Credit-Card Records By JOHN D. MCKINNON Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL WASHINGTON -- Card-carrying tax cheats, beware. Uncle Sam is about to start peeking into credit-card accounts in search of thousands of Americans taking part in a fun-in-the-sun tax-avoidance scam that is part of a $70 billion-a-year drain on federal revenue. After months of haggling, the Internal Revenue Service and the Justice Department are close to an agreement with American Express Co. to turn over records from customers who pay their bills through banks in the Bahamas, the Cayman Islands and other tax havens, people familiar with the matter said. A second company, MasterCard International Ltd., also is in negotiations, MasterCard spokeswoman Sharon Gamsin said. The IRS, which declined to comment on the matter, is trying to identify and possibly prosecute cheats who use a simple and apparently increasingly popular scheme. Here is how it typically works: A taxpayer hires a lawyer in an offshore tax haven to create a sham corporation to hide the taxpayer's identity. Then the corporation obtains a credit card from a local bank and opens an account there. The taxpayer puts a bunch of unreported income into the account, thereby both hiding that sum from the IRS and avoiding taxes on the interest. The card is then used for purchases, and the lawyer pays the card balance from the corporate account, or the bank simply deducts the money itself. In some cases, the cardholder never even gets a monthly bill, leaving no incriminating paper trail. Getting access to the individual customer records will let the IRS compare customers' transactions with their tax returns. Investigators suspect that taxpayers aren't disclosing their control of offshore accounts, as they are required to on their tax returns. Taxpayers who are making use of the credit-card scam also are likely underreporting their income, by leaving out the money they have shipped offshore -- or at least aren't reporting the interest their accounts are earning. Taxpayers involved in the scam face big trouble, including back taxes, stiff penalties and possibly criminal charges. Thousands of taxpayers -- possibly tens of thousands -- are believed to have taken advantage of offshore accounts and credit cards. The scheme has been widely marketed on the Internet and elsewhere by lawyers and banks with offshore branches, often with a pitch that U.S. residents can skip paying taxes and avoid detection. One IRS consultant, Washington lawyer Jack Blum, estimated in 2000 that illegal offshore tax shelters cost the government $70 billion a year. Much of that involves individual taxpayers, but it is unclear how much involves credit-card holders. The credit-card scam has been going on for years. The IRS was slow to catch on, but a series of investigations in the mid-1990s revealed how it worked. All the IRS lacked were the names of tax cheats -- information it couldn't get from offshore banks in Caribbean tax havens because they refuse to share financial data with the U.S. So the IRS turned to U.S. credit-card networks, which were no more eager to turn over records. The IRS went to federal court in Miami in 2000 to ask a judge to force American Express and MasterCard to turn over records related to cards issued by offshore banks or were paid for from funds drawn on them. "We know from our experience that we've had consistent abuses," an IRS official who asked to remain anonymous said at the time. "Our experience indicates there are a lot of U.S. persons doing business and utilizing banks in those countries. We expect a number -- whether 5,000, 50,000 or 100,000, we don't know. We expect it to go into the thousands." U.S. District Judge Adalberto Jordan granted the request in October 2000. Thus began a long negotiation between the government and the credit-card companies. The IRS wanted broad disclosure, while the credit-card companies sought a narrow scope. The government's initial request covered 1998 and 1999 and involved Antigua and Barbuda, the Bahamas and the Cayman Islands, but the IRS is likely to expand its scrutiny to additional years, other tax havens and other card companies. For the Bush administration, the credit-card-scam crackdown serves a purpose beyond increasing revenue without raising taxes. It could provide a much-needed boost to its tax-shelter record, which some tax experts have criticized recently as insufficiently aggressive. The administration has sought to counter that impression, demanding more information about other kinds of shelters that U.S. promoters market onshore and setting the stage for nasty legal battles with accounting firms that are trying to protect their clients' identities. The IRS publicly hinted at progress in the negotiations with American Express and MasterCard in January, during an international tax conference in Miami. "If people think it's going to fade into the woodwork for lack of attention by the bureaucrats, they're sadly mistaken," Robert Panoff, a Miami tax lawyer who moderated the discussion, said in a later interview. "The IRS is like an elephant: It walks real slow, but if you're in its way when it gets to you it'll squash you." Mr. Panoff, who defends taxpayers, says he is encouraging his clients to avoid more-serious problems by fessing up now with amended returns. "But the window for doing so is getting smaller and smaller," he said. Even if the crackdown doesn't reap multiple scofflaws, a broader purpose of the investigation still would be served by access to the records -- identifying the scope of the offshore problem. The records could give investigators unprecedented insights into this murky world. IRS officials say privately that they suspect the use of credit cards by tax cheats began to increase about five years ago, with the rise of Internet sites that hawk the deals. Those sites continue to pitch a wide range of deals, lately including cards linking holders with U.S. automated teller machine networks. For example, a palm-draped Web site called Cardster this week advertised "top security anonymous offshore 'no ID' ATM Cirrus debit card," as well as other services. Law-enforcement officials say offshore credit and debit cards are so secure that they are effectively safer than cash. The cards typically are imprinted with meaningless account names and in some cases just numbers. Account holders can use phony names, so even signed card receipts don't offer any direct connection to a taxpayer. Because of their security advantages, offshore cards increasingly are used not only to evade taxes but also to make illicit payments and fund criminal operations. That is further elevating concern over offshore accounts, both for the Bush administration and other officials. The administration has recently announced tax information-sharing agreements recently with several of the major tax havens, including the Bahamas and the Cayman Islands. Those are expected to enhance the ability of U.S. tax authorities to find out more about suspected tax dodgers in the future. But the agreements only become effective over a period of years and have other limitations. For now, "if they're getting deposits into an offshore account, they are getting away with it," said John W. Moscow, deputy chief of the investigations division for New York City's Manhattan District Attorney Robert Morgenthau, a longtime critic of tax havens and their bank-secrecy laws.<hr /></blockquote>I just quoted this post to piss you off.<hr /></blockquote>Or is it "I quoted this post just to piss you off."? Don't know, but I think it worked.

Davvve

05-16-2002, 10:26 AM

I realize this is quite an old thread, but I'd really like to get some suggestions on off-shore banks, that provide online banking and debit cards, that can be trusted. Mostly I'd like to get suggestions on respected banks that aren't too expensive.

BTW, has anyone tried new formed and cheaper companies like cardster.net ??

Thanks!

Harpo

05-16-2002, 12:44 PM

I'm from EU...Italy...
A country where we have about 60-65% of tax...where HDSL costs 0.045 Euro at Mb - Mb...it means about 50$ at Gb-how you can do?
I know-undirect-if you have money in Swiss there are people that they pick them at your bank and give them at your home.Cost?10% of the total.If they the police arrest them and confiscate the money you are refounded.Not sure?They work with the bank.Your money are insured till your home by the bank!
Anyway I wouldn't open a CC online without see on the face another person...
I agree with the people that say it's right to pay tax in your country,also the 60%,but depends what you have in the other hand....We don't have dentist,for an Xray I have to wait months... an insurance's car costs as an average salary,the petrol costs more than 1 Euro.it's not nice...I really agree with the people say it's a must to pay tax,but you have to see both hands.

Davvve

05-16-2002, 04:51 PM

Yeah, i can see your point. But the thing is that I want to test one of these anon cards and see if they work. It'd be nice to have a little money going through a card like that. I would never take the risk only using an anon CC.

Dave